| Business Bank Charges [message #368561] |
Do, 09 März 2006 23:40 |
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I run a dsitribution company and have an average of £40-£50k siiting in my
Lloyds TSB business account at any one time (as well as a sum of around
£100k tied up in a 30-day Standard Life business savings account).
I issue around 20 cheques per month and also have a fair amount of
electronic credits and other transcartion in and out of the account.
I'm now out of my two-year free-the-reduced banking period.
My average bank charges are around £30-£35/month. I deeply begrudge paying
this given that I get little value (or even contact from my bank). They
simply keep sending me cheque books and paying me a piss poor rate of
interest on this working capital.
As I also factor my debt - around £40k/month) with their factoring division
Lloyds TSB Commercial Finance.... and as well as myself and my business
Co-Director having a further 5 personal accounts with Lloyds - what is the
NG opinion as to my position regarding getting them to waive my bank charges
and allow me free banking for life?
I've already threatened them with account closure if they will not bend, but
they didn't even have the decency to discuss it - just wrote a crap letter
outlining the reasons for my unhappiness then refusing to do so.
Once I get my year-end out of the way in a month or so I'm quite willing
(although would rather not) to change business and personal banks.
Opinions please?
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #368582 ] |
Fr, 10 März 2006 10:59 |
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Trevor Kingston <t.kingston [at] rmplc.com> wrote:
> I run a dsitribution company and have an average of ?40-?50k siiting in my
> Lloyds TSB business account at any one time (as well as a sum of around
> ?100k tied up in a 30-day Standard Life business savings account).
>
> I issue around 20 cheques per month and also have a fair amount of
> electronic credits and other transcartion in and out of the account.
>
> I'm now out of my two-year free-the-reduced banking period.
>
> My average bank charges are around ?30-?35/month. I deeply begrudge paying
> this given that I get little value (or even contact from my bank). They
> simply keep sending me cheque books and paying me a piss poor rate of
> interest on this working capital.
>
> As I also factor my debt - around ?40k/month) with their factoring division
> Lloyds TSB Commercial Finance.... and as well as myself and my business
> Co-Director having a further 5 personal accounts with Lloyds - what is the
> NG opinion as to my position regarding getting them to waive my bank charges
> and allow me free banking for life?
>
> I've already threatened them with account closure if they will not bend, but
> they didn't even have the decency to discuss it - just wrote a crap letter
> outlining the reasons for my unhappiness then refusing to do so.
>
> Once I get my year-end out of the way in a month or so I'm quite willing
> (although would rather not) to change business and personal banks.
>
Abbey Business banking would be free for you I would guess.
My Ltd. company usually has only around 10k sitting in the current
account (it varies quite a bit), I probably write rather fewer cheques
than you, probably only ten or so per month, but there are quite a few
electronic transactions as well. The Abbey have just paid me interest
(not a lot but better than nothing) on my balance and no charges at
all.
--
Chris Green
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373529 ] |
Mo, 13 März 2006 20:22 |
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"Trevor Kingston" <t.kingston [at] rmplc.com> wrote in message
news:duqatm$83g$1 [at] news.freedom2surf.net...
>I run a dsitribution company and have an average of £40-£50k siiting in my
> Lloyds TSB business account at any one time (as well as a sum of around
> £100k tied up in a 30-day Standard Life business savings account).
>
> I issue around 20 cheques per month and also have a fair amount of
> electronic credits and other transcartion in and out of the account.
>
> I'm now out of my two-year free-the-reduced banking period.
>
> My average bank charges are around £30-£35/month. I deeply begrudge paying
> this given that I get little value (or even contact from my bank). They
> simply keep sending me cheque books and paying me a piss poor rate of
> interest on this working capital.
>
> As I also factor my debt - around £40k/month) with their factoring
> division
> Lloyds TSB Commercial Finance.... and as well as myself and my business
> Co-Director having a further 5 personal accounts with Lloyds - what is the
> NG opinion as to my position regarding getting them to waive my bank
> charges
> and allow me free banking for life?
>
> I've already threatened them with account closure if they will not bend,
> but
> they didn't even have the decency to discuss it - just wrote a crap letter
> outlining the reasons for my unhappiness then refusing to do so.
>
> Once I get my year-end out of the way in a month or so I'm quite willing
> (although would rather not) to change business and personal banks.
>
> Opinions please?
>
>
Without doubt, change bank.
--
Adrian Smith
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373532 ] |
Mo, 13 März 2006 22:31 |
|
"Adrian Smith" <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> wrote in message
news:vDjRf.35335$wl.3588 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> "Trevor Kingston" <t.kingston [at] rmplc.com> wrote in message
> news:duqatm$83g$1 [at] news.freedom2surf.net...
>>I run a dsitribution company and have an average of £40-£50k siiting in my
>> Lloyds TSB business account at any one time (as well as a sum of around
>> £100k tied up in a 30-day Standard Life business savings account).
>>
>> I issue around 20 cheques per month and also have a fair amount of
>> electronic credits and other transcartion in and out of the account.
>>
>> I'm now out of my two-year free-the-reduced banking period.
>>
>> My average bank charges are around £30-£35/month. I deeply begrudge
>> paying
>> this given that I get little value (or even contact from my bank). They
>> simply keep sending me cheque books and paying me a piss poor rate of
>> interest on this working capital.
>>
>> As I also factor my debt - around £40k/month) with their factoring
>> division
>> Lloyds TSB Commercial Finance.... and as well as myself and my business
>> Co-Director having a further 5 personal accounts with Lloyds - what is
>> the
>> NG opinion as to my position regarding getting them to waive my bank
>> charges
>> and allow me free banking for life?
>>
>> I've already threatened them with account closure if they will not bend,
>> but
>> they didn't even have the decency to discuss it - just wrote a crap
>> letter
>> outlining the reasons for my unhappiness then refusing to do so.
>>
>> Once I get my year-end out of the way in a month or so I'm quite willing
>> (although would rather not) to change business and personal banks.
>>
>> Opinions please?
>>
>>
>
> Without doubt, change bank.
>
> --
> Adrian Smith
>
Can I ask one question here. Would you work for one of your clients free of
charge. What if they threaten to take their business elswhere?
I know the answer - of course you would not work for free but you expect the
bank to do so. Your bank charges are tax deductable.
By all means change banks if you so desire but why should they work for no
return?
If you have so much sitting doing nothing ask about a sweep facility to a
business savings account or put some of it on call with their treasury
division.
>
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373537 ] |
Mo, 13 März 2006 23:21 |
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"Eric Jones" <ejones999 [at] btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:dv4obd$676$1 [at] nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...
>
> "Adrian Smith" <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> wrote in message
> news:vDjRf.35335$wl.3588 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>> "Trevor Kingston" <t.kingston [at] rmplc.com> wrote in message
>> news:duqatm$83g$1 [at] news.freedom2surf.net...
>>>I run a dsitribution company and have an average of £40-£50k siiting in
>>>my
>>> Lloyds TSB business account at any one time (as well as a sum of around
>>> £100k tied up in a 30-day Standard Life business savings account).
>>>
>>> I issue around 20 cheques per month and also have a fair amount of
>>> electronic credits and other transcartion in and out of the account.
>>>
>>> I'm now out of my two-year free-the-reduced banking period.
>>>
>>> My average bank charges are around £30-£35/month. I deeply begrudge
>>> paying
>>> this given that I get little value (or even contact from my bank). They
>>> simply keep sending me cheque books and paying me a piss poor rate of
>>> interest on this working capital.
>>>
>>> As I also factor my debt - around £40k/month) with their factoring
>>> division
>>> Lloyds TSB Commercial Finance.... and as well as myself and my business
>>> Co-Director having a further 5 personal accounts with Lloyds - what is
>>> the
>>> NG opinion as to my position regarding getting them to waive my bank
>>> charges
>>> and allow me free banking for life?
>>>
>>> I've already threatened them with account closure if they will not bend,
>>> but
>>> they didn't even have the decency to discuss it - just wrote a crap
>>> letter
>>> outlining the reasons for my unhappiness then refusing to do so.
>>>
>>> Once I get my year-end out of the way in a month or so I'm quite willing
>>> (although would rather not) to change business and personal banks.
>>>
>>> Opinions please?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Without doubt, change bank.
>>
>> --
>> Adrian Smith
>>
>
> Can I ask one question here. Would you work for one of your clients free
> of charge. What if they threaten to take their business elswhere?
> I know the answer - of course you would not work for free but you expect
> the bank to do so. Your bank charges are tax deductable.
> By all means change banks if you so desire but why should they work for no
> return?
> If you have so much sitting doing nothing ask about a sweep facility to a
> business savings account or put some of it on call with their treasury
> division.
>>
>
>
Don't be dumb, banks make big profits from business accounts because they
are not regulated as strictly as personal accounts.
1/ If a bank can operate an individuals personal account for free and make a
profit then why should a business pay more.
2/ You don't need to worry on behalf of your bank. They are more than
capable of looking after themselves.
Your loyalty towards your bank is admirable but rest assured it is
misplaced.
--
Adrian Smith
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373541 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 00:06 |
|
"Adrian Smith" <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> wrote in message
news:KfmRf.35513$wl.9177 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> "Eric Jones" <ejones999 [at] btinternet.com> wrote in message
> news:dv4obd$676$1 [at] nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...
>>
>> "Adrian Smith" <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> wrote in message
>> news:vDjRf.35335$wl.3588 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>>> "Trevor Kingston" <t.kingston [at] rmplc.com> wrote in message
>>> news:duqatm$83g$1 [at] news.freedom2surf.net...
>>>>I run a dsitribution company and have an average of £40-£50k siiting in
>>>>my
>>>> Lloyds TSB business account at any one time (as well as a sum of around
>>>> £100k tied up in a 30-day Standard Life business savings account).
>>>>
>>>> I issue around 20 cheques per month and also have a fair amount of
>>>> electronic credits and other transcartion in and out of the account.
>>>>
>>>> I'm now out of my two-year free-the-reduced banking period.
>>>>
>>>> My average bank charges are around £30-£35/month. I deeply begrudge
>>>> paying
>>>> this given that I get little value (or even contact from my bank). They
>>>> simply keep sending me cheque books and paying me a piss poor rate of
>>>> interest on this working capital.
>>>>
>>>> As I also factor my debt - around £40k/month) with their factoring
>>>> division
>>>> Lloyds TSB Commercial Finance.... and as well as myself and my business
>>>> Co-Director having a further 5 personal accounts with Lloyds - what is
>>>> the
>>>> NG opinion as to my position regarding getting them to waive my bank
>>>> charges
>>>> and allow me free banking for life?
>>>>
>>>> I've already threatened them with account closure if they will not
>>>> bend, but
>>>> they didn't even have the decency to discuss it - just wrote a crap
>>>> letter
>>>> outlining the reasons for my unhappiness then refusing to do so.
>>>>
>>>> Once I get my year-end out of the way in a month or so I'm quite
>>>> willing
>>>> (although would rather not) to change business and personal banks.
>>>>
>>>> Opinions please?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Without doubt, change bank.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Adrian Smith
>>>
>>
>> Can I ask one question here. Would you work for one of your clients free
>> of charge. What if they threaten to take their business elswhere?
>> I know the answer - of course you would not work for free but you expect
>> the bank to do so. Your bank charges are tax deductable.
>> By all means change banks if you so desire but why should they work for
>> no return?
>> If you have so much sitting doing nothing ask about a sweep facility to a
>> business savings account or put some of it on call with their treasury
>> division.
>>>
>>
>>
>
> Don't be dumb, banks make big profits from business accounts because they
> are not regulated as strictly as personal accounts.
>
> 1/ If a bank can operate an individuals personal account for free and make
> a profit then why should a business pay more.
> 2/ You don't need to worry on behalf of your bank. They are more than
> capable of looking after themselves.
>
> Your loyalty towards your bank is admirable but rest assured it is
> misplaced.
>
> --
> Adrian Smith
>
>You call me dumb! It's your company that is sitting on all this money and
>is not earning for you.
Why would any other bank offer you services if it did not get paid for it?
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373542 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 00:03 |
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In message <KfmRf.35513$wl.9177 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Adrian
Smith <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> writes
>> Can I ask one question here. Would you work for one of your clients free
>> of charge. What if they threaten to take their business elswhere?
>> I know the answer - of course you would not work for free but you expect
>> the bank to do so. Your bank charges are tax deductable.
>> By all means change banks if you so desire but why should they work for no
>> return?
>> If you have so much sitting doing nothing ask about a sweep facility to a
>> business savings account or put some of it on call with their treasury
>> division.
>>>
>>
>>
>
>Don't be dumb,
??? Who?
>banks make big profits from business accounts because they
>are not regulated as strictly as personal accounts.
Balderdash. The two are priced completely differently because they
operate in different markets.
>
>1/ If a bank can operate an individuals personal account for free and make a
>profit
Eh? Where on earth did you get that idea? How can bank make any profit
merely by operating a free personal account?
Come on, you are calling Eric 'dumb', so perhaps you can explain how
bank makes money merely on a free current account?
It is only done so as to acquire the client and then obtain profitable
collateral business. Its a loss leader. Isnt that obvious?
>then why should a business pay more.
A business doesnt pay 'more', it pays for what it gets.
>2/ You don't need to worry on behalf of your bank. They are more than
>capable of looking after themselves.
Hmmm, I dont understand the relevance of this. Sour grapes or jealousy
perhaps?
>
>Your loyalty towards your bank is admirable but rest assured it is
>misplaced.
Ahh! A man of knowledge! (sadly not).
--
John Boyle
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373546 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 00:48 |
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>>
>>You call me dumb! It's your company that is sitting on all this money and
>>is not earning for you.
> Why would any other bank offer you services if it did not get paid for it?
>
Hey it's not my company that's sitting on this cash. That does seem
wasteful.
However it is the responsibility of the bank to both remain competitive and
profitable.
My responsibility is to ensure that my own business is competitive and
profitable.
Apologies for calling you dumb.... I'm sure your not dumb at all :-)
Adrian.
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373550 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 01:13 |
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"john boyle" <john [at] johnboyle1.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:W9vY8$Q9ofFEFwyy [at] johnboyle1.demon.co.uk...
> In message <KfmRf.35513$wl.9177 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Adrian Smith
> <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> writes
>
>>> Can I ask one question here. Would you work for one of your clients free
>>> of charge. What if they threaten to take their business elswhere?
>>> I know the answer - of course you would not work for free but you expect
>>> the bank to do so. Your bank charges are tax deductable.
>>> By all means change banks if you so desire but why should they work for
>>> no
>>> return?
>>> If you have so much sitting doing nothing ask about a sweep facility to
>>> a
>>> business savings account or put some of it on call with their treasury
>>> division.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Don't be dumb,
>
> ??? Who?
>
>>banks make big profits from business accounts because they
>>are not regulated as strictly as personal accounts.
>
> Balderdash. The two are priced completely differently because they operate
> in different markets.
>>
>>1/ If a bank can operate an individuals personal account for free and make
>>a
>>profit
>
> Eh? Where on earth did you get that idea? How can bank make any profit
> merely by operating a free personal account?
>
> Come on, you are calling Eric 'dumb', so perhaps you can explain how bank
> makes money merely on a free current account?
>
> It is only done so as to acquire the client and then obtain profitable
> collateral business. Its a loss leader. Isnt that obvious?
>
>>then why should a business pay more.
>
> A business doesnt pay 'more', it pays for what it gets.
>
>>2/ You don't need to worry on behalf of your bank. They are more than
>>capable of looking after themselves.
>
> Hmmm, I dont understand the relevance of this. Sour grapes or jealousy
> perhaps?
>>
>>Your loyalty towards your bank is admirable but rest assured it is
>>misplaced.
>
> Ahh! A man of knowledge! (sadly not).
> --
> John Boyle
You don't get it John.
Far from being 'sour grapes' or 'jealousy' it's simply not my responsibility
to worry (or even care) that the bank makes a profit.
--
Adrian Smith
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373552 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 01:25 |
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In message <mUnRf.35610$wl.31524 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Adrian
Smith <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> writes
>You don't get it John.
>
>Far from being 'sour grapes' or 'jealousy' it's simply not my responsibility
>to worry (or even care) that the bank makes a profit.
So why did you make the post to which I responded? And why did you make
such incorrect assertions?
--
John Boyle
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373554 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 02:08 |
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"john boyle" <john [at] johnboyle1.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:uiimrkSL2gFEFwEU [at] johnboyle1.demon.co.uk...
> In message <mUnRf.35610$wl.31524 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Adrian Smith
> <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> writes
>
>>You don't get it John.
>>
>>Far from being 'sour grapes' or 'jealousy' it's simply not my
>>responsibility
>>to worry (or even care) that the bank makes a profit.
>
> So why did you make the post to which I responded? And why did you make
> such incorrect assertions?
> --
> John Boyle
My original post simply advised the OP to change banks. One of the big
problems with the UK banking system is that not enough people change banks
when they feel they have received a raw deal.
I stand by my assertions in my following mail and challenge you to show
otherwise, without splitting hairs and being petty.
Apart from me calling Eric dumb of course which I freely admit was me being
dumb:-)
--
Adrian Smith
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373556 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 02:21 |
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Adrian Smith <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> wrote:
[]
> However it is the responsibility of the bank to both remain competitive and
> profitable.
Hedge your bet - buy shares in the bank[0] - I'd have done a *lot*
better out of $BANK if I'd done that in ~1995-2005, rather than just
have a mortgage & TESSA/deposit a/c with them.
ISTR the suggestion, many years ago, that one should buy BL cars, as the
taxpayer had /already/ underwritten them by 500 quid a go - OK that's a
bit silly, but you get my drift...
rgds, Alan
[0] 'course if you've got any index-tracking PEP/ISA/Pension stuff, then
that's ~35% banks anyway.
--
99 Ducati 748BP, 95 Ducati 600SS, 81 Guzzi Monza, 74 MV Agusta 350
"Ride to Work, Work to Ride" SI# 7.067 DoD#1930 PGP Key 0xBDED56C5
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| Re: Business Bank Charges [message #373565 ] |
Di, 14 März 2006 10:25 |
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In message <BIoRf.35630$wl.30732 [at] text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Adrian
Smith <A.Smith [at] YourStadium.com> writes
>My original post simply advised the OP to change banks. One of the big
>problems with the UK banking system is that not enough people change banks
>when they feel they have received a raw deal.
I agree with that, the banks rely on customer inertia.
>
>I stand by my assertions in my following mail and challenge you to show
>otherwise,
I am giving facts and you are expressing an opinion. My facts have been
derived from a very considerable period working in a bank. I really do
think the 'loss leading' aspect of free personal banking is common
knowledge and I would be interesting to know how a bank can possibly
make money when the average credit balances are relatively small.
As an example, a typical employed individual on the average salary which
is paid in to his account, and if the persons spending pattern is
typical, i.e. most pre-authorised payments scheduled for the beginning
of the salary month, then a typical average balance is about £600. Banks
internal accounting give this value at base rate, but lets assume it is
lent on at 6.5%, this means the account has to cost less than £39 per
annum before the bank makes any money. The trouble is it costs more than
that.
>without splitting hairs and being petty.
I dont do that!
>
>Apart from me calling Eric dumb of course which I freely admit was me being
>dumb:-)
Fair enough. That did annoy me and inspired the tone of my original
reply.
>
--
John Boyle
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