Business Calculators

I'm interested in buying a business calculator, and I thought I may as
well get one that's approved for use in the actuarial exams. The list I
got from a CAS web page is

BA-35
BA II Plus
BA II Plus Professional
TI-30X
TI-30X a
TI-30X II

I think the TI-30Xes are scientific calculators, and I have a few of
those. Does anyone have strong opinions or recommendations for a business
calculator?


--
"Will we be suturing the anus?"

Re: Business Calculators

I like the BA II Plus for ease of use, but I cannot judge it versus with the
others.

"Gregory L. Hansen" <> wrote in message
news:dgmtbh$3r0$
>
> I'm interested in buying a business calculator, and I thought I may as
> well get one that's approved for use in the actuarial exams. The list I
> got from a CAS web page is
>
> BA-35
> BA II Plus
> BA II Plus Professional
> TI-30X
> TI-30X a
> TI-30X II
>
> I think the TI-30Xes are scientific calculators, and I have a few of
> those. Does anyone have strong opinions or recommendations for a business
> calculator?
>
>
> --
> "Will we be suturing the anus?"

Re: Business Calculators

Gregory L. Hansen wrote:

> I'm interested in buying a business calculator, and I thought I may as
> well get one that's approved for use in the actuarial exams. The list I
> got from a CAS web page is
>
> BA-35
> BA II Plus
> BA II Plus Professional
> TI-30X
> TI-30X a
> TI-30X II
>
> I think the TI-30Xes are scientific calculators, and I have a few of
> those. Does anyone have strong opinions or recommendations for a business
> calculator?

Unless the portability of having a calculator in your pocket appeals to
you, you can do virtually everything on your Excel spreadsheet on your
laptop, much better than with any calculator. Your Excel spreadsheet
*is* a calculator.


--
Steven D. Litvintchouk
Email:

Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me.

Re: Business Calculators

In article <JoKXe.565$>,
Marlowe <> wrote:
>I like the BA II Plus for ease of use, but I cannot judge it versus with the
>others.
>
>"Gregory L. Hansen" <> wrote in message
>news:dgmtbh$3r0$
>>
>> I'm interested in buying a business calculator, and I thought I may as
>> well get one that's approved for use in the actuarial exams. The list I
>> got from a CAS web page is
>>
>> BA-35
>> BA II Plus
>> BA II Plus Professional
>> TI-30X
>> TI-30X a
>> TI-30X II
>>
>> I think the TI-30Xes are scientific calculators, and I have a few of
>> those. Does anyone have strong opinions or recommendations for a business
>> calculator?

The BA series got a lot of unfavorable remarks versus the HPs on Amazon.
But I suppose if they're commonly used, they can't be horrible.

--
"No one need be surprised that the subject of contagion was not clear to
our ancestors."-- Heironymus Fracastorius, 1546

Re: Business Calculators

In article <n5mYe.1487$>,
Steven L. <> wrote:
>Gregory L. Hansen wrote:
>
>> I'm interested in buying a business calculator, and I thought I may as
>> well get one that's approved for use in the actuarial exams. The list I
>> got from a CAS web page is
>>
>> BA-35
>> BA II Plus
>> BA II Plus Professional
>> TI-30X
>> TI-30X a
>> TI-30X II
>>
>> I think the TI-30Xes are scientific calculators, and I have a few of
>> those. Does anyone have strong opinions or recommendations for a business
>> calculator?
>
>Unless the portability of having a calculator in your pocket appeals to
>you, you can do virtually everything on your Excel spreadsheet on your
>laptop, much better than with any calculator. Your Excel spreadsheet
>*is* a calculator.

Why, yes, I am interested in the portability of having a calculator in my
pocket. And the difficulty of sneaking Excel spreadsheets into exams.
The calculator boots faster, too.

--
"The hardest conviction to get into the mind of the beginner is that the
education he is receiving in college is not a medical course but a life
course for which the work of a few years under teachers is but a
preparation." -- Sir William Osler

Re: Business Calculators

One thing that I discovered when I spent my short stint as a financial
planner was that the "old heads" cut their teeth on the HP financial
calculators and are very adamant the HPs are the only way to go. Despite
having to use RPN (Reverse Polish Notation) which to me is a very clumsy way
to use a calculator. When I showed up at the office with my $30 BA II Plus
they gave me a hard time until I demonstrated that my $30 calculator could
do the same functions as their pricey HP calcs and do it faster.

As an aside, I recently was vacationing and needed a calculator and bought a
$4 "Le World" scientific calculator. It is unbelievable. I can convert
numbers from decimal to hexadecimal to octal to binary with a single key
stroke, in addition to all the regular scientific calculations. This has
the same capability of the HP scientific calculator (yes it had the dreaded
RPN) that NASA issued to me in 1972 that had a price tag of $395. I was
branch chief of 35 engineers and programmers and we all had to share it.
Gosh how times have changed.


"Gregory L. Hansen" <> wrote in message
news:dgsuqr$4f3$
> In article <JoKXe.565$>,
> Marlowe <> wrote:
>>I like the BA II Plus for ease of use, but I cannot judge it versus with
>>the
>>others.
>>
>>"Gregory L. Hansen" <> wrote in message
>>news:dgmtbh$3r0$
>>>
>>> I'm interested in buying a business calculator, and I thought I may as
>>> well get one that's approved for use in the actuarial exams. The list I
>>> got from a CAS web page is
>>>
>>> BA-35
>>> BA II Plus
>>> BA II Plus Professional
>>> TI-30X
>>> TI-30X a
>>> TI-30X II
>>>
>>> I think the TI-30Xes are scientific calculators, and I have a few of
>>> those. Does anyone have strong opinions or recommendations for a
>>> business
>>> calculator?
>
> The BA series got a lot of unfavorable remarks versus the HPs on Amazon.
> But I suppose if they're commonly used, they can't be horrible.
>
> --
> "No one need be surprised that the subject of contagion was not clear to
> our ancestors."-- Heironymus Fracastorius, 1546

Re: Business Calculators

I can understand RPN if you're programming a primitive parser that pushes
numbers on to a stack and pops them off. But I've never understood why
people would purposefully make the effort to train themselves to calculate
that way when they didn't have to.


In article <NFzYe.2154$>,
Marlowe <> wrote:
>One thing that I discovered when I spent my short stint as a financial
>planner was that the "old heads" cut their teeth on the HP financial
>calculators and are very adamant the HPs are the only way to go. Despite
>having to use RPN (Reverse Polish Notation) which to me is a very clumsy way
>to use a calculator. When I showed up at the office with my $30 BA II Plus
>they gave me a hard time until I demonstrated that my $30 calculator could
>do the same functions as their pricey HP calcs and do it faster.
>
>As an aside, I recently was vacationing and needed a calculator and bought a
>$4 "Le World" scientific calculator. It is unbelievable. I can convert
>numbers from decimal to hexadecimal to octal to binary with a single key
>stroke, in addition to all the regular scientific calculations. This has
>the same capability of the HP scientific calculator (yes it had the dreaded
>RPN) that NASA issued to me in 1972 that had a price tag of $395. I was
>branch chief of 35 engineers and programmers and we all had to share it.
>Gosh how times have changed.
>
>
>"Gregory L. Hansen" <> wrote in message
>news:dgsuqr$4f3$
>> In article <JoKXe.565$>,
>> Marlowe <> wrote:
>>>I like the BA II Plus for ease of use, but I cannot judge it versus with
>>>the
>>>others.
>>>
>>>"Gregory L. Hansen" <> wrote in message
>>>news:dgmtbh$3r0$
>>>>
>>>> I'm interested in buying a business calculator, and I thought I may as
>>>> well get one that's approved for use in the actuarial exams. The list I
>>>> got from a CAS web page is
>>>>
>>>> BA-35
>>>> BA II Plus
>>>> BA II Plus Professional
>>>> TI-30X
>>>> TI-30X a
>>>> TI-30X II
>>>>
>>>> I think the TI-30Xes are scientific calculators, and I have a few of
>>>> those. Does anyone have strong opinions or recommendations for a
>>>> business
>>>> calculator?
>>
>> The BA series got a lot of unfavorable remarks versus the HPs on Amazon.
>> But I suppose if they're commonly used, they can't be horrible.
>>
>> --
>> "No one need be surprised that the subject of contagion was not clear to
>> our ancestors."-- Heironymus Fracastorius, 1546
>
>


--
"Tell me, Dr. Einstein, at what time does Boston arrive at this train?"

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-23, Gregory L. Hansen <> wrote:
> I can understand RPN if you're programming a primitive parser that pushes
> numbers on to a stack and pops them off.

As a scientist, I find it much easier to do complicated chains of
calculations with RPN than with a "normal" calculator.

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

> As a scientist, I find it much easier to do complicated chains of
> calculations with RPN than with a "normal" calculator.

That's good news, I thought anything tougher than tying your shoes would
have you calling for help.

If the government will pay $600 for a toilet seat but call it something
else, how much will they pay for Greg Hennessey and call him a 'scientist'?

Re: Business Calculators

Marlowe wrote:
> One thing that I discovered when I spent my short stint as a financial
> planner was that the "old heads" cut their teeth on the HP financial
> calculators and are very adamant the HPs are the only way to go. Despite
> having to use RPN (Reverse Polish Notation) which to me is a very clumsy way
> to use a calculator.

Why is it clumsy? It takes the fewest number of keystrokes, and it
took me, a slow learner, only a few minutes to get used to it.

Re: Business Calculators

Gregory L. Hansen wrote:

> I can understand RPN if you're programming a primitive parser that pushes
> numbers on to a stack and pops them off. But I've never understood why
> people would purposefully make the effort to train themselves to calculate
> that way when they didn't have to.

Because you don't have to worry about balancing deep nests of
parentheses. Remembering when to open and close a parenthesis in a
complex calculation takes powers of mental visualization.


--
Steven D. Litvintchouk
Email:

Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me.

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-23, Ed <> wrote:
> That's good news, I thought anything tougher than tying your shoes would
> have you calling for help.

Ed, why don't you fuck off and die?

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

>> That's good news, I thought anything tougher than tying your shoes would
>> have you calling for help.
>
> Ed, why don't you fuck off and die?

Everyone dies but what a mean thing to say.

Perhaps you are beginning to understand how it feels to have you constantly
responding to my posts with nothing more than inflammatory remarks. That's
good.

Where did you get your degee in science? How far did you go? PhD?

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-23, Ed <> wrote:
>> Ed, why don't you fuck off and die?
>
> Everyone dies but what a mean thing to say.

You have been an asshole towards me for literally years. I'm finally
responding in kind.

> Perhaps you are beginning to understand how it feels to have you constantly
> responding to my posts with nothing more than inflammatory remarks.

I never insulted you in any posts, nor posted irrelavent things. When
you would boast about beating the index, I would point out it was all
unverifiable, or point out your public picks to beat the index didn't,
both of which are appropriate discussions on
misc.invest.mutual-funds.

Jumping into a post about calculators to post nothing but insults to
me show what a bitter man you are.

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

> On 2005-09-23, Ed <> wrote:
>>> Ed, why don't you fuck off and die?
>>
>> Everyone dies but what a mean thing to say.
>
> You have been an asshole towards me for literally years. I'm finally
> responding in kind.

I really thought is was the other way around, I'm not kidding.

>> Perhaps you are beginning to understand how it feels to have you
>> constantly
>> responding to my posts with nothing more than inflammatory remarks.
>
> I never insulted you in any posts, nor posted irrelavent things. When
> you would boast about beating the index, I would point out it was all
> unverifiable,

Yes, you called me a liar. Anything anyone says here is unverifiable. If you
want absolute verifiable fact then what the hell are you doing here?

> or point out your public picks to beat the index didn't,
> both of which are appropriate discussions on
> misc.invest.mutual-funds.

That was buy and hold and it was for fun. If you can tie your shoes you know
that. I have my doubts.

> Jumping into a post about calculators to post nothing but insults to
> me show what a bitter man you are.

I'm not. That's why I try to get down to "the most magical place on earth"
at least once each year. I love being around people, especially happy
children.

You, on the other hand, are one of the biggest assholes I've encountered.
So, where did you get your degree in science? How far did you go? PhD?

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote in message
news:

> Jumping into a post about calculators to post nothing but insults to
> me show what a bitter man you are.
>

Greg:

Please. By responding (and inflicting it on the rest of us) you are just
giving this psychotic what he craves.

If you can't ignore it, use your killfile.

-herb

Re: Business Calculators

"Herb" <> wrote

> Please. By responding (and inflicting it on the rest of us) you are just
> giving this psychotic what he craves.
>
> If you can't ignore it, use your killfile.
>
> -herb

I've already suggested that, at least I think I have.
Can you tell me, how come you're so stupid?

Father Herb....

....explaining the obvious to ears that are turned away. Greg loves me, I can
tell. He won't put me in his killfile because I help him to understand his
shortcomings. He needs me.

You put me in your killfile because you insist on being Herb, the Master
Baiter from Bates. Too bad for you. You need to get out of your room.

My apology.

> You put me in your killfile because you insist on being Herb, the Master
> Baiter from Bates. Too bad for you. You need to get out of your room.

That should be Maturbater, not Master Baiter. Oh, you get the idea.

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-23, Ed <> wrote:
> I really thought is was the other way around, I'm not kidding.

Yea, I had the temerity to have a different opinion than you, and
posted it, so you think I'm an asshole. *shrug* Not my problem.

> Yes, you called me a liar.

Only when I absolutely necessary, such as when you would make a false
claim, saying I said a certain thing, when I hadn't.

>Anything anyone says here is unverifiable.

That is false. I can post what the Dow Jones average was on Jan 1st,
and that is completely verifiable. I can post "Ed said x, y, and z"
and you can use the google archive to verify its truth.

You have in the past said I claimed certain things, when I never
did. And when you did so I said those were lies.

>> or point out your public picks to beat the index didn't,
>> both of which are appropriate discussions on
>> misc.invest.mutual-funds.
>
> That was buy and hold and it was for fun.

And my posting that they didn't beat the index was for fun.

> So, where did you get your degree in science? How far did you go? PhD?

I've answered all those questions in the past. If you want to find
out, visit the google archives.

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-23, Herb <> wrote:
> Please. By responding (and inflicting it on the rest of us) you are just
> giving this psychotic what he craves.

Good point. I'll just killfile him.

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote in message
news:
> On 2005-09-23, Herb <> wrote:
> > Please. By responding (and inflicting it on the rest of us) you are
just
> > giving this psychotic what he craves.
>
> Good point. I'll just killfile him.

Thank you. When he morphs into another one of his many personalities to get
around your filter just killfile him again. Trust me, the only thing that
bothers him is being ignored.

-herb

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

> On 2005-09-23, Ed <> wrote:
>> I really thought is was the other way around, I'm not kidding.
>
> Yea, I had the temerity to have a different opinion than you, and
> posted it, so you think I'm an asshole. *shrug* Not my problem.

I think you're an asshole? Not likely.

>>Anything anyone says here is unverifiable.
>
> That is false. I can post what the Dow Jones average was on Jan 1st,
> and that is completely verifiable. I can post "Ed said x, y, and z"
> and you can use the google archive to verify its truth.

This is BS.

> You have in the past said I claimed certain things, when I never
> did. And when you did so I said those were lies.

You were wrong then and you are wrong now.

>>> or point out your public picks to beat the index didn't,
>>> both of which are appropriate discussions on
>>> misc.invest.mutual-funds.
>>
>> That was buy and hold and it was for fun.
>
> And my posting that they didn't beat the index was for fun.

I don't think so.

>> So, where did you get your degree in science? How far did you go? PhD?

> I've answered all those questions in the past. If you want to find
> out, visit the google archives.

You're a liar, and an asshole.

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

> Good point. I'll just killfile him.

Thank you. If you do you'll make mimf a better place.

Re: Business Calculators

"Herb" <> wrote
> "Greg Hennessy" <> wrote
> > On 2005-09-23, Herb <> wrote:
> > > Please. By responding (and inflicting it on the rest of us) you are
> just
> > > giving this psychotic what he craves.
> >
> > Good point. I'll just killfile him.
>
> Thank you. When he morphs into another one of his many personalities to
get
> around your filter just killfile him again. Trust me, the only thing that
> bothers him is being ignored.

Greg, FWIW, I hope you remember again that this Ed guy (a.k.a. Samantha,
Marjorie, Jim (sic), among others) is an equal opportunity insulter. I
suggest no one here take his insults personally, as his wide target range is
indicative that _he_ has a problem. I remain glad that certain folks who
left this NG for awhile have since returned and figured out how to put a
damper on his efforts to, let's face it, destroy this newsgroup. I don't
always agree with these folks, but there's more civility among them than
with Eddie.

You use a Hewlett Packard graphing calculator these days, right? The only
reason I gave up my HP RPN calculator c. 2000 is because the TI graphing
calculators were all the rage, with plenty of info about operating them
available, and I really liked that big ol' screen showing prior
calculations, full tables of numbers, etc.

Re: Business Calculators

In article <>,
Greg Hennessy <> wrote:
>On 2005-09-23, Gregory L. Hansen <> wrote:
>> I can understand RPN if you're programming a primitive parser that pushes
>> numbers on to a stack and pops them off.
>
>As a scientist, I find it much easier to do complicated chains of
>calculations with RPN than with a "normal" calculator.
>

I have a PhD in physics, and I've never seen the attraction.


--
"Yes, I revere you much, honored ones, and wish to fart in response." --
Aristophanes, Clouds

Re: Business Calculators

I do admit that after awhile I did get use to RPN but then I would screw up
when I was confronted with a conventional calculator. Maybe it is just me.
Back in 1975 I started one of the first personal computer clubs in the USA
and I invited a rep from HP to tell us about what HP was doing in the small
computer arena. Someone asked him about PRN on their calculators and he
tried to defend it. He said that it was HP's most common criticism of their
calculators but HP was adamant that it was most superior. It sounded rather
arrogant to me and more like "HP knows what's best, more than our customers
do."



"larry moe 'n curly" <> wrote in message
news:
>
> Marlowe wrote:
>> One thing that I discovered when I spent my short stint as a financial
>> planner was that the "old heads" cut their teeth on the HP financial
>> calculators and are very adamant the HPs are the only way to go. Despite
>> having to use RPN (Reverse Polish Notation) which to me is a very clumsy
>> way
>> to use a calculator.
>
> Why is it clumsy? It takes the fewest number of keystrokes, and it
> took me, a slow learner, only a few minutes to get used to it.
>

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-23, Herb <> wrote:
> Thank you. When he morphs into another one of his many personalities to get
> around your filter just killfile him again.

What else does he use? I've just seen the net, which is the
address I killfiled.

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-23, Elle <> wrote:
> You use a Hewlett Packard graphing calculator these days, right? The only
> reason I gave up my HP RPN calculator c. 2000 is because the TI graphing
> calculators were all the rage, with plenty of info about operating them
> available, and I really liked that big ol' screen showing prior
> calculations, full tables of numbers, etc.

I used a HP 15C in college, beat it to hell, got a new HP 32 when I
graduated, and am in mortal fear of what to do when it no longer
works, since I don't think they make those anymore.

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-24, Gregory L. Hansen <> wrote:
>>As a scientist, I find it much easier to do complicated chains of
>>calculations with RPN than with a "normal" calculator.
>
> I have a PhD in physics, and I've never seen the attraction.

As I think Steve mentioned, no trying to bother about parenthesis.

If I try to do a long calculation I am much less likely to make an
error with a HP than with a TI.

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote in message
news:
> On 2005-09-23, Herb <> wrote:
> > Thank you. When he morphs into another one of his many personalities to
get
> > around your filter just killfile him again.
>
> What else does he use? I've just seen the net, which is the
> address I killfiled.


He seems to think it makes him look clever to forge fake names. He will
probably create one just for you. In OE you can simply pull down the
"message" menu and choose "block sender." When it asks you if you want to
delete all messages from this sender say 'yes' and it's over.

Other newsreaders may vary.

-herb

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

> On 2005-09-23, Herb <> wrote:
>> Thank you. When he morphs into another one of his many personalities to
>> get
>> around your filter just killfile him again.
>
> What else does he use? I've just seen the net, which is the
> address I killfiled.

It doesn't matter. If you elect not to read my posts you won't see them
under if that is the e-mail address that you have kill filed.

If you make inflammatory remarks aimed at me or, like Herb, practice
trolling aimed at me, you will get a response. Just forget that I'm here at
all and we'll get along just fine.

Re: Business Calculators

I have most, if not the entire HP RPN series of 80XXX code emulators.
They're semi-ancient programs from national file centers found on
boards, such as yours, as commerically pressed CD distributions existed
before writers (x1 CD media). Couldn't be worse than the last
calculator I bought, a Radio Shack product. Damn thing didn't seem, at
all, to calculate. A hand-held, fold-open, two-sided touchpad for a
logic chip engineered to recognize BASIC. Disconcerting to have
stumbled upon a language so candidly, but, given a will, BASIC served
well enough after a month on it to move along to an IBM MPU.

Marlowe wrote:
> I do admit that after awhile I did get use to RPN but then I would screw up
> when I was confronted with a conventional calculator. Maybe it is just me.
> Back in 1975 I started one of the first personal computer clubs in the USA
> and I invited a rep from HP to tell us about what HP was doing in the small
> computer arena. Someone asked him about PRN on their calculators and he
> tried to defend it. He said that it was HP's most common criticism of their
> calculators but HP was adamant that it was most superior. It sounded rather
> arrogant to me and more like "HP knows what's best, more than our customers
> do."

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-24, Sudsy <> wrote:
> It doesn't matter. If you elect not to read my posts you won't see them
> under if that is the e-mail address that you have kill filed.

Ah, I guess you can't resist trying to be seen. First you throw a
temper tantrum designed to be so obnoxious I drop you in a kill file,
then you post under multiple names to avoid a kill file.

What scum.

*plonks another name into the killfile*

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

> What scum.

That's unbecoming. Can't you be civil?
Go practice tying your shoes, just think, no more velcro.

Re: Business Calculators

On 2005-09-24, Bob <> wrote:
> That's unbecoming. Can't you be civil?

I was, for way longer than you were.

*plonk*

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote

> On 2005-09-24, Bob <> wrote:
>> That's unbecoming. Can't you be civil?
>
> I was, for way longer than you were.
>
> *plonk*

"Scum", "die", "f--k off".
Where did you learn such things?
I don't believe I said any of those things to you.

"Plonk your magic twanger, Froggy".

Re: Business Calculators

"Greg Hennessy" <> wrote in message
news:
> On 2005-09-24, Sudsy <> wrote:
> > It doesn't matter. If you elect not to read my posts you won't see them
> > under if that is the e-mail address that you have kill
filed.
>
> Ah, I guess you can't resist trying to be seen. First you throw a
> temper tantrum designed to be so obnoxious I drop you in a kill file,
> then you post under multiple names to avoid a kill file.
>
> What scum.
>
> *plonks another name into the killfile*

Greg:

You are still feeding the troll. Please try harder to stop.

-herb

Re: Business Calculators

"Herb" <> wrote

> You are still feeding the troll. Please try harder to stop.

You are the troll, Herbie.
Did you ever think of minding your own business?

Re: Business Calculators

"Elle" <> wrote

> Greg, FWIW, I hope you remember again that this Ed guy (a.k.a. Samantha,
> Marjorie, Jim

Good point Caroline, Taliban, Elle, Butch, Dyke, whatever.

Re: Business Calculators

Darn, but I just love this group to death...../g/. ..When I'm feeling glum,
I just come here and it always puts a smile on my face... :-)

Happy Guy
-
"Betty" <> wrote in message
news:
>
> "Elle" <> wrote
>
>> Greg, FWIW, I hope you remember again that this Ed guy (a.k.a. Samantha,
>> Marjorie, Jim
>
> Good point Caroline, Taliban, Elle, Butch, Dyke, whatever.
>