ETf's ?

I am rather new to investing and would like to know is ETF's can be
bought from within a Fund Family which is a retirement account.

Thanks in advance


meantime I will keep reading.

Re: ETf's ?

You need to open an IRA with a broker.
ETF's are becoming more popular all the time.





<> wrote in message
news:
>I am rather new to investing and would like to know is ETF's can be
> bought from within a Fund Family which is a retirement account.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
>
> meantime I will keep reading.

Re: ETf's ?

I think maybe you don't have the vocabulary straight.

One can hold either ETFs, mutual funds, stocks, cash, CDs, bonds or any
combination of these in an IRA. One can spread one's IRAs over several
different holding companies. For example, Wells Fargo may contain 20% of
your IRA holdings. Vanguard may have the remaining 80%.

As far as "fund families" are concerned, do you mean does a company like
Vanguard have ETFs that mimick, in construction, its mutual fund offerings?

It has a number that do, yes.

<> wrote
> I am rather new to investing and would like to know is ETF's can be
> bought from within a Fund Family which is a retirement account.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
>
> meantime I will keep reading.

Re: ETf's ?

Because you have to pay a broker a commission to own an exchange traded
fund, you want to invest as much as you can (within reason) to keep the
expenses down. If you want to invest small amounts at a time, you will
be better off opening an account with someone like T Rowe Price and by
there mutual funds. Vanguard is good but they have higher minimums for
the initial investment.

Also while you can invest in ETF's in an IRA, they usually are more tax
efficient than actively managed mutual funds. So if you have
non-retirement money available, it would be better to put the stock
ETF's outside an IRA, and invest your IRA money in something that needs
sheltering from short term gains and divendends. One exception would
be an ETF like DVY. Though it has short term distributions of
dividends, they will qualify for the 5%/15% tax.

Mo

Re: ETf's ?

What I like about ETF's is there are no early redemption fees. I know this
doesn't count in an IRA but it's important. You can also sell an ETF today
and buy it back tomorrow, try that at Vanguard.



"Maurice" <> wrote in message
news:
> Because you have to pay a broker a commission to own an exchange traded
> fund, you want to invest as much as you can (within reason) to keep the
> expenses down. If you want to invest small amounts at a time, you will
> be better off opening an account with someone like T Rowe Price and by
> there mutual funds. Vanguard is good but they have higher minimums for
> the initial investment.
>
> Also while you can invest in ETF's in an IRA, they usually are more tax
> efficient than actively managed mutual funds. So if you have
> non-retirement money available, it would be better to put the stock
> ETF's outside an IRA, and invest your IRA money in something that needs
> sheltering from short term gains and divendends. One exception would
> be an ETF like DVY. Though it has short term distributions of
> dividends, they will qualify for the 5%/15% tax.
>
> Mo
>

Re: ETf's ?

Hi Ed. I'm not trying to discourage anyone from buying ETF's. But if
you are going to invest $100 or $500 at a time, the commissions will
eat you alive. That was my point. Btw, If eight is going to be
trading, then you should tell him about CEF's. I'm not experienced
yet, so let it come from the master.

Mo

Re: ETf's ?

"Maurice" <> wrote

> Hi Ed. I'm not trying to discourage anyone from buying ETF's. But if
> you are going to invest $100 or $500 at a time, the commissions will
> eat you alive. That was my point. Btw, If eight is going to be
> trading, then you should tell him about CEF's. I'm not experienced
> yet, so let it come from the master.
>
> Mo

I understand your point and it's true, if you DCA then Vanguard is for you.

I am not currently holding any CEF's, I don't like the looks of things. I'm
55.46% in money markets, according to Morningstar Xray. Besides, anyone
that's "rather new to investing" shouldn't even look at CEF's. Look what
happened to ruffian! She bought into CEE and in 2 days lost about 15%.

Re: ETf's ?

wrote:
> I am rather new to investing and would like to know is ETF's can be
> bought from within a Fund Family which is a retirement account.

Just ask fidelity to convert your mutual account to a fidelity
brokerage account - practically no downside, and then you can mix etf's
with fidelity and non-fidelity mutual funds. I would keep at least one
fidelity fund in there for incremental purchases, but then you can
redeploy it in big chunks to etf's and other funds at rebalancing
times.

P.S. fidelity's FULLVIEW function gives me error msgs all the time
saying their server is down - anyone else? fidelity says it is
user-end problem with browser config. Even tho I get problems with
several browsers, I tried some others where it appears to work - anyone
know the key config fix?

Re: ETf's ?

dumbstruck wrote:
>
> wrote:
> > I am rather new to investing and would like to know is ETF's can be
> > bought from within a Fund Family which is a retirement account.
>
> Just ask fidelity to convert your mutual account to a fidelity
> brokerage account - practically no downside, and then you can mix etf's
> with fidelity and non-fidelity mutual funds. I would keep at least one
> fidelity fund in there for incremental purchases, but then you can
> redeploy it in big chunks to etf's and other funds at rebalancing
> times.

I don't think the OP said that this was a Fidelity IRA, but your point
is essentially correct - an IRA that is with a fund family can only hold
funds in that family, but the fund family may offer brokerage accounts,
and brokerage accounts can hold "almost anything".

There is at least one minor downside of such a conversion - if one has a
fund that offers checkwriting, then that service cannot be used within a
brokerage account. For example, suppose I have a brokerage account that
contains Fidelity Government MMF, while the "core" account is Fidelity
Cash Reserves. I cannot write checks from the Government MMF; I must
first transfer the money to Cash Reserves, and then write a check
against the brokerage account. If I had these funds in a non-brokerage
account, I could write checks against either of them.

I believe that this rule is generally (if not universally) followed by
all fund supermarket brokerage accounts.

> P.S. fidelity's FULLVIEW function gives me error msgs all the time
> saying their server is down - anyone else? fidelity says it is
> user-end problem with browser config. Even tho I get problems with
> several browsers, I tried some others where it appears to work - anyone
> know the key config fix?

I have found that their server really is down toward the middle of the
night; are you finding some browsers work and others don't at the same
time, or do you try the others the next morning? Just a thought.

--
Mark Freeland

Re: ETf's ?

On Sun, 09 Oct 2005 21:18:05 GMT, "Elle"
<> wrote:

>I think maybe you don't have the vocabulary straight.
>
>One can hold either ETFs, mutual funds, stocks, cash, CDs, bonds or any
>combination of these in an IRA. One can spread one's IRAs over several
>different holding companies. For example, Wells Fargo may contain 20% of
>your IRA holdings. Vanguard may have the remaining 80%.
>
>As far as "fund families" are concerned, do you mean does a company like
>Vanguard have ETFs that mimick, in construction, its mutual fund offerings?
>
>It has a number that do, yes.
>

Thanks to ALL and Elle for the answers you have provided.

I am referring to fund families like Vangrd.

I want more say so about what I am holding and when I can sell and
when I can buy. Perhaps the question should be, if you open a fund,
labeled IRA and you have cash reserves, can you buy an ETF and
another fund or so under the account?

I was thinking I might need to pay taxes on the earings IRA and end
it then merely have a plain account to do a few trades per year.
Probably no more that six or so.

I just got sick of seeing the thirty, and ninty day "profit takers"
bleed off the eranings on a regular basis. I had watched this action
go on for a very long time with any number of funds and I guess if I
had been fully adivsed and in charge I would have learned all this a
long time ago.

I feel that I might be able to pick stocks/ETF's which are solid and
have enough greatness to preform at an above average rate.

I realize that I probably know enough to be dangerous to myself
but I am reading and trying to ferret out what would work within
the frame work of an IRA and what won't.




><> wrote
>> I am rather new to investing and would like to know is ETF's can be
>> bought from within a Fund Family which is a retirement account.
>>
>> Thanks in advance
>>
>>
>> meantime I will keep reading.
>

Re: ETf's ?

On 9 Oct 2005 20:38:14 -0700, "dumbstruck" <>
wrote:

> wrote:
>> I am rather new to investing and would like to know is ETF's can be
>> bought from within a Fund Family which is a retirement account.
>
>Just ask fidelity to convert your mutual account to a fidelity
>brokerage account - practically no downside, and then you can mix etf's
>with fidelity and non-fidelity mutual funds. I would keep at least one
>fidelity fund in there for incremental purchases, but then you can
>redeploy it in big chunks to etf's and other funds at rebalancing
>times.
>
>P.S. fidelity's FULLVIEW function gives me error msgs all the time
>saying their server is down - anyone else? fidelity says it is
>user-end problem with browser config. Even tho I get problems with
>several browsers, I tried some others where it appears to work - anyone
>know the key config fix?


Thanks for your taking time to provide tips and hints.

I take it that you like Fidelity pretty well; I heard its good
several times.

Re: ETf's ?

<> wrote
> On Sun, 09 Oct 2005 21:18:05 GMT, "Elle"
> <> wrote:
>
> >I think maybe you don't have the vocabulary straight.
> >
> >One can hold either ETFs, mutual funds, stocks, cash, CDs, bonds or any
> >combination of these in an IRA. One can spread one's IRAs over several
> >different holding companies. For example, Wells Fargo may contain 20% of
> >your IRA holdings. Vanguard may have the remaining 80%.
> >
> >As far as "fund families" are concerned, do you mean does a company like
> >Vanguard have ETFs that mimick, in construction, its mutual fund
offerings?
> >
> >It has a number that do, yes.
> >
>
> Thanks to ALL and Elle for the answers you have provided.
>
> I am referring to fund families like Vangrd.
>
> I want more say so about what I am holding and when I can sell and
> when I can buy. Perhaps the question should be, if you open a fund,

Here, you mean open an account, then buy shares of either a fund, ETF, or
stock (or whatever) to put into this account. The account may be an IRA
account. Or it may be a non-IRA account.

> labeled IRA and you have cash reserves, can you buy an ETF and
> another fund or so under the account?

As a matter of federal law, absolutely.

But some companies might require you to have a brokerage IRA account and a
mutual fund IRA account. BUT they're both still IRAs, and federal law for
tax purposes yada sees them as one big "Individual Retirement Account."

Vanguard apparently did not allow mixing of stocks and mutual funds in the
same account for awhile. You had to have two Vanguard accounts.

The total annual, allowed contribution for all your IRA accounts is still
set by federal law.

> I was thinking I might need to pay taxes on the earings IRA and end
> it then merely have a plain account to do a few trades per year.
> Probably no more that six or so.

One can do stock trades within an IRA account.

You do not have to cash out your IRA and so pay that nasty IRS penalty just
so you can do stock or ETF trades(!).

> I just got sick of seeing the thirty, and ninty day "profit takers"
> bleed off the eranings on a regular basis. I had watched this action
> go on for a very long time with any number of funds and I guess if I
> had been fully adivsed and in charge I would have learned all this a
> long time ago.
>
> I feel that I might be able to pick stocks/ETF's which are solid and
> have enough greatness to preform at an above average rate.

Sure, maybe so. And you can do this with an IRA. I haven't done this with my
IRA (so far), but I am thinking about it.

> I realize that I probably know enough to be dangerous to myself
> but I am reading and trying to ferret out what would work within
> the frame work of an IRA and what won't.

You're doing the right thing. The only stupid question is an unasked one
(assuming you've made a reasonable effort to find the answer from written
sources).

Remember there's no big rush. Take as much as six months to figure out how
you want to do things, say.

I suggest posting the following question at misc.invest.financial-plan:

What are the pros and cons of doing stock/ETF trading within one's IRA
account?

There's some minutiae that I bet will come up concerning the loss of tax
advantages when one gives up the commission on such trades.

Not sure I answered all your questions. Just start with Vanguard is a little
odd about its brokerage account, probably because it was focused for a long
time on strictly (I think) mutual funds.

Re: ETf's ?

On Mon, 10 Oct 2005 15:41:33 GMT, "Elle"
<> wrote:

><> wrote
>> On Sun, 09 Oct 2005 21:18:05 GMT, "Elle"
>> <> wrote:
>>
>> >I think maybe you don't have the vocabulary straight.
>> >
>> >One can hold either ETFs, mutual funds, stocks, cash, CDs, bonds or any
>> >combination of these in an IRA. One can spread one's IRAs over several
>> >different holding companies. For example, Wells Fargo may contain 20% of
>> >your IRA holdings. Vanguard may have the remaining 80%.
>> >
>> >As far as "fund families" are concerned, do you mean does a company like
>> >Vanguard have ETFs that mimick, in construction, its mutual fund
>offerings?
>> >
>> >It has a number that do, yes.
>> >
>>
>> Thanks to ALL and Elle for the answers you have provided.
>>
>> I am referring to fund families like Vangrd.
>>
>> I want more say so about what I am holding and when I can sell and
>> when I can buy. Perhaps the question should be, if you open a fund,
>
>Here, you mean open an account, then buy shares of either a fund, ETF, or
>stock (or whatever) to put into this account. The account may be an IRA
>account. Or it may be a non-IRA account.
>
>> labeled IRA and you have cash reserves, can you buy an ETF and
>> another fund or so under the account?
>
>As a matter of federal law, absolutely.
>
>But some companies might require you to have a brokerage IRA account and a
>mutual fund IRA account. BUT they're both still IRAs, and federal law for
>tax purposes yada sees them as one big "Individual Retirement Account."
>
>Vanguard apparently did not allow mixing of stocks and mutual funds in the
>same account for awhile. You had to have two Vanguard accounts.
>
>The total annual, allowed contribution for all your IRA accounts is still
>set by federal law.
>
>> I was thinking I might need to pay taxes on the earings IRA and end
>> it then merely have a plain account to do a few trades per year.
>> Probably no more that six or so.
>
>One can do stock trades within an IRA account.
>
>You do not have to cash out your IRA and so pay that nasty IRS penalty just
>so you can do stock or ETF trades(!).
>
>> I just got sick of seeing the thirty, and ninty day "profit takers"
>> bleed off the eranings on a regular basis. I had watched this action
>> go on for a very long time with any number of funds and I guess if I
>> had been fully adivsed and in charge I would have learned all this a
>> long time ago.
>>
>> I feel that I might be able to pick stocks/ETF's which are solid and
>> have enough greatness to preform at an above average rate.
>
>Sure, maybe so. And you can do this with an IRA. I haven't done this with my
>IRA (so far), but I am thinking about it.
>
>> I realize that I probably know enough to be dangerous to myself
>> but I am reading and trying to ferret out what would work within
>> the frame work of an IRA and what won't.
>
>You're doing the right thing. The only stupid question is an unasked one
>(assuming you've made a reasonable effort to find the answer from written
>sources).
>
>Remember there's no big rush. Take as much as six months to figure out how
>you want to do things, say.
>
>I suggest posting the following question at misc.invest.financial-plan:
>
>What are the pros and cons of doing stock/ETF trading within one's IRA
>account?
>
>There's some minutiae that I bet will come up concerning the loss of tax
>advantages when one gives up the commission on such trades.
>
>Not sure I answered all your questions. Just start with Vanguard is a little
>odd about its brokerage account, probably because it was focused for a long
>time on strictly (I think) mutual funds.
>


Thank your for your generous answers. I really appreciate your
remarks.

Re: ETf's ?

-
<> wrote in message
news:
> On Mon, 10 Oct 2005 15:41:33 GMT, "Elle"
> <> wrote:
>
>><> wrote
>>> On Sun, 09 Oct 2005 21:18:05 GMT, "Elle"
>>> <> wrote:
>>>
>>> >I think maybe you don't have the vocabulary straight.
>>> >
>>> >One can hold either ETFs, mutual funds, stocks, cash, CDs, bonds or any
>>> >combination of these in an IRA. One can spread one's IRAs over several
>>> >different holding companies. For example, Wells Fargo may contain 20%
>>> >of
>>> >your IRA holdings. Vanguard may have the remaining 80%.
>>> >
>>> >As far as "fund families" are concerned, do you mean does a company
>>> >like
>>> >Vanguard have ETFs that mimick, in construction, its mutual fund
>>offerings?
>>> >
>>> >It has a number that do, yes.
>>> >
>>>
>>> Thanks to ALL and Elle for the answers you have provided.
>>>
>>> I am referring to fund families like Vangrd.
>>>
>>> I want more say so about what I am holding and when I can sell and
>>> when I can buy. Perhaps the question should be, if you open a fund,
>>
>>Here, you mean open an account, then buy shares of either a fund, ETF, or
>>stock (or whatever) to put into this account. The account may be an IRA
>>account. Or it may be a non-IRA account.
>>
>>> labeled IRA and you have cash reserves, can you buy an ETF and
>>> another fund or so under the account?
>>
>>As a matter of federal law, absolutely.
>>
>>But some companies might require you to have a brokerage IRA account and a
>>mutual fund IRA account. BUT they're both still IRAs, and federal law for
>>tax purposes yada sees them as one big "Individual Retirement Account."
>>
>>Vanguard apparently did not allow mixing of stocks and mutual funds in the
>>same account for awhile. You had to have two Vanguard accounts.
>>
>>The total annual, allowed contribution for all your IRA accounts is still
>>set by federal law.
>>
>>> I was thinking I might need to pay taxes on the earings IRA and end
>>> it then merely have a plain account to do a few trades per year.
>>> Probably no more that six or so.
>>
>>One can do stock trades within an IRA account.
>>
>>You do not have to cash out your IRA and so pay that nasty IRS penalty
>>just
>>so you can do stock or ETF trades(!).
>>
>>> I just got sick of seeing the thirty, and ninty day "profit takers"
>>> bleed off the eranings on a regular basis. I had watched this action
>>> go on for a very long time with any number of funds and I guess if I
>>> had been fully adivsed and in charge I would have learned all this a
>>> long time ago.
>>>
>>> I feel that I might be able to pick stocks/ETF's which are solid and
>>> have enough greatness to preform at an above average rate.
>>
>>Sure, maybe so. And you can do this with an IRA. I haven't done this with
>>my
>>IRA (so far), but I am thinking about it.
>>
>>> I realize that I probably know enough to be dangerous to myself
>>> but I am reading and trying to ferret out what would work within
>>> the frame work of an IRA and what won't.
>>
>>You're doing the right thing. The only stupid question is an unasked one
>>(assuming you've made a reasonable effort to find the answer from written
>>sources).
>>
>>Remember there's no big rush. Take as much as six months to figure out how
>>you want to do things, say.
>>
>>I suggest posting the following question at misc.invest.financial-plan:
>>
>>What are the pros and cons of doing stock/ETF trading within one's IRA
>>account?
>>
>>There's some minutiae that I bet will come up concerning the loss of tax
>>advantages when one gives up the commission on such trades.
>>
>>Not sure I answered all your questions. Just start with Vanguard is a
>>little
>>odd about its brokerage account, probably because it was focused for a
>>long
>>time on strictly (I think) mutual funds.
>>
>
>
> Thank your for your generous answers. I really appreciate your
> remarks.

thanks for putting your simple response at the bottom..... what the hell
were you thinking?

Happy Guy

Re: ETf's ?

>>
>> Thank your for your generous answers. I really appreciate your
>> remarks.
>
>thanks for putting your simple response at the bottom..... what the hell
>were you thinking?
>
>Happy Guy
>

I am not sure what to think at the moment except.... what the hell is
your problem?

Re: ETf's ?

My problem is people that just have to say 'thank you' and to see it I have
to page down 5 screens.

Is it that difficult to put it at the top, moron?.............. we've read
the stupid notes before. we don't have to waste our valuable time on
multiple notes going to the bottom to see an insipid one line reply.....

Did you even think about putting it at the top.... if the reply is of
interest or we are suffering from
dementia, we can go through all the crap to see what we missed......

And, if you really gave it just the tiniest bit to thought, YOU could erase
most of the crap that is just getting repeated over and over and over, ad
infinitum and ad nauseum.....

btw, I may be using the word 'moron' incorrectly. Maybe you are just
ignorant.....and now, if you read the above, that condition has been
rectified....

Happy Guy
-
<> wrote in message
news:
>
>>>
>>> Thank your for your generous answers. I really appreciate your
>>> remarks.
>>
>>thanks for putting your simple response at the bottom..... what the hell
>>were you thinking?
>>
>>Happy Guy
>>
>
> I am not sure what to think at the moment except.... what the hell is
> your problem?
>

Re: ETf's ?

Go, happy guy!!!

BTW, you are doing fantastic in the contest.

DJIA closed 2004 at 10,783 and is 10,253 now.
SP500 closed at 1,212 and is 1,185 now.
Nas100 closed at 1,621 and is 1,539 now.
R2000 closed at 652 and is 630 now.
Wil5000 closed at 11,968 and is 11,830 now.

Not easy making money with domestic stocks this year but you are doing very
vwell. Only 2 of out 7 players are down while all of the above indices are
down, none of them are buy and hold. I think timing is the way to go.

I'm currently 4th out of the 7, dead center. I wonder if NoEd will be able
to use this post to determine if I'm losing money this year?

For those that may be wondering, happy guy is #1 in our contest.

Re: ETf's ?

Since I play both sides, bull and bear, I need down trends to give me a
boost over b/h. And I've gotten some help lately on that front........ I've
made some goofs with my system (which I constantly tinker with), but right
now, it's looking good.

Can we end the contest now??<g>.... only kidding. I feel like I'm on track,
so we'll see how it goes till the end of the year.

Happy Guy
-
"Ed" <> wrote in message
news:
> Go, happy guy!!!
>
> BTW, you are doing fantastic in the contest.
>
> DJIA closed 2004 at 10,783 and is 10,253 now.
> SP500 closed at 1,212 and is 1,185 now.
> Nas100 closed at 1,621 and is 1,539 now.
> R2000 closed at 652 and is 630 now.
> Wil5000 closed at 11,968 and is 11,830 now.
>
> Not easy making money with domestic stocks this year but you are doing
> very vwell. Only 2 of out 7 players are down while all of the above
> indices are down, none of them are buy and hold. I think timing is the way
> to go.
>
> I'm currently 4th out of the 7, dead center. I wonder if NoEd will be able
> to use this post to determine if I'm losing money this year?
>
> For those that may be wondering, happy guy is #1 in our contest.
>
>
>